Here's a total repost of the thread from Aficio League. Seems Ricoh is getting very defensive about this.
What my questions are for all of y'all is how has this 1224/32 series been launched to you?
We were told the following... "This can be placed anywhere you would place a 1022/1027 and in many cases the 1232 can be placed in lieu of a 1035/2035 system."
From what this thread indicates, it is nothing of the sort. It won't even hold up to the placement of a 1022/27 for volume and useability.
Thoughts???
REPOSTED FROM AFICIO LEAGUE
Conf: COLOR: Product-Related Discussion
From: Ted Kochman ted@p4photel.com
Date: Tuesday, May 20, 2003 09:10 AM
(The following was posted on the p4photel.com website by one of the members. We would appreciate any additional comments or responses, especially from Ricoh personnel.)
"Is everyone else finding themselves constantly putting out new install fires regarding the toner check and auto calibration the 1224C and 1232C do. There is a 5 second pause in mid job every 50 (or less)copies for them to check toner and a 5 MINUTE pause every 200 (or less) copies for auto color calibration. The 200 copies can be lengthened to 1000 but I don't know what the ramifications are. There is nothing that can be done about the check toner every 50 copies. These numbers get worse in heavy coverage environments because a pixel count can trigger a quicker check. We also find that the toner check happens about 40% quicker if the starter cartridges are in compared to the full-sized cartridges.
I have two separate installs coming back because of these delays in copy/print production.
I strongly recommend that you don't encourage someone used to faster equipment to consider one of these units.
I would love to hear back from those who have some installs of these units."
Visit the p4photel.com
Conf: COLOR: Product-Related Discussion
From: Dave Callahan david.callahan@ricoh-usa.com
Date: Tuesday, May 20, 2003 10:47 PM
The only ramification for waiting until 1000 copies for calibration versus 200 is consistent color quality on long runs ... but then again if you are selling this for long run jobs, well you just placed this system outside of its intended target ... the general office volumes up to 8,000 per month.
The setting for check toner every 50 copies? I would suggest that your technicians check with Ricoh tech support for a recommendation in making changes.
Afterall, we sales personnel are not technicians. But we need to make them aware of these concerns from the field. Nothing creates urgency like a request from the field.
Conf: COLOR: Product-Related Discussion
From: Megan McKnight mmcknight@nexusofficesystems.com
Date: Monday, June 02, 2003 10:10 AM
I agree that perhaps the 1224/1232 was sold to the wrong type of customer then it was designed for if you're having issues with the amount of calibrating and toner checks the machine does. For anyone who is concerned about consistency in the quality of their color documents from copy 1 to copy 200, the self-calibration is crucial. I have some color customers with Graphics Color Machines that program their machines to recalibrate after 5 copies to ensure quality. I would hope as sales consultants for our customers, we would all talk about that pre-sale. If you get all the information out on the table about how a color machine works, there should be no problem once it is installed, because the customer will understand what is going on. And for the price of this machine, the calibration and toner checking is really not that bad. These are designed for people that either have not had color in their offices before, or who are using things like color laser printers. Obviously we are not going to move a Canon CLC customer to a 1224 or 1232.
As far as my customers that have purchased these machines, they love them! Their newsletters, brochures, and proposals look so much better with splashes of color!
Conf: COLOR: Product-Related Discussion
From: Dave Callahan david.callahan@ricoh-usa.com
Date: Tuesday, June 03, 2003 10:03 AM
Ted,
I hope the person who originally placed this concern has been notified through the P4P Hotel as well. Thanks Megan for that wonderful ad. When place correctly, customers do love the output from the 1224C/1232C Series.
Conf: COLOR: Product-Related Discussion
From: Ted Kochman ted@p4photel.com
Date: Tuesday, June 03, 2003 10:18 AM
Yes Dave, all replies to the original question have been and new ones will be posted on the p4photel website. Thanks for the answers and suggestions y'all!
Ted
Visit the p4photel.com
Conf: COLOR: Product-Related Discussion
From: Jim Parker jim@cbs-digital.com
Date: Monday, June 23, 2003 03:05 PM
Being the one who placed the original question I can say that unless someone doing 5,000/mo. and next to no color is "the wrong type of customer" you are sadly mistaken.
Let me rephrase that...it was the wrong type of customer but for reasons that aren't expressed by the launches and material. The issue is run length and it doesn't take near as long a run length as you think. I challenge anyone to run 35 sets of a 4 page B&W legal document duplexed. There is just short of 11 minutes of pauses for "Self-checking / Warming up". That's 11 minutes of non-printing during a 35 set run. Every 2.5 sets there is a pause for a minimum of 40 seconds but as long as several minutes. Don't suggest to me that our training taught us that someone doing 35 sets was "the wrong type of customer".
Don't get me wrong, I'm still glad to have the 1200 series models but I feel Ricoh is doing us a great disservice by not helping us to understand what triggers the pauses and why so that we can be prepared and prepare.
P4P Hotel has the complete run-down of the 8 potential pauses and their triggers.
Conf: COLOR: Product-Related Discussion
From: Dave Callahan david.callahan@ricoh-usa.com
Date: Tuesday, June 24, 2003 08:42 AM
Jim,
Our responses were given based on the information given to us. There is no information about the business or their applications, just a concern over toner checks and calibrations.
All that was given was that on longer runs, you notice the pauses are more dramatic and frequent, and page coverage effect on toner checks and calibrations. I will stand behind all responses that say this system is not intended for long runs. 5,000 pages per month breaks down to about 225 pages per day. 35 sets of a 4-page document just ran over 50% of that intended volume ... sorry, but I would consider that a long run.
Take it for what it is, a response to information given.
Conf: COLOR: Product-Related Discussion
From: Graham Taylor graham@p4photel.com
Date: Tuesday, June 24, 2003 10:29 AM
Here's my thoughts...
What troubles me is that if we show these systems as replacements/alternatives for the 22/27, the marketing and internal launch materials show this as well, and our Ricoh reps tout them as replacements for UP TO A 1035 then we are really creating an recipe for disaster. We all know that the 22/27 will do this run that has been talked about with no problems.
Any thoughts?
Original Post
