Tagged With "maintenance"
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Re: Best Black & White MFP for 10k/month yeild. Suggestions?
First is this your actual reply to the account looking at thoseToshiba products listed (455 & 305)? If yes and they have a great history with the Toshiba product, telling them there a "bottom dweller" would make anyone think that you're only wanting to sell them what YOU'RE offering. The models they requested are older models of Toshiba and who knows if they've worked well for them or not. Also if you research the Okidata product, most of their MFP's are based on the Toshiba platform now...
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Re: Best Black & White MFP for 10k/month yeild. Suggestions?
Actually, I did not mention that I am offering any equipment to them. I'm not even sure where they are located, I'm not looking to sell them, All of the recent MFP's that I've seen at the shows have pretty much the same GUI> I do remember something about a more robust partnering with Toshiba/
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Re: Best Black & White MFP for 10k/month yeild. Suggestions?
FYI: Toshiba, overall, is in the top ten for R&D Spend-to-Sales ratios. "Bottom dweller" really is not a fair use of words. With any device manufacturer, product is only as good as its dealer support. Get references if need be. RE: maintenance; The asker is talking B&W devices not color. Regardless, get the maintenance. Fewer spikes in copy quality or hardware issues because you'll make that phone call to fix rather than putting up with poor copy quality, etc. for fear of how much it...
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Re: Best Black & White MFP for 10k/month yeild. Suggestions?
TimB: Thanx for the comment! I believe you with the top ten in R & D for Spend to Sales ratios, but I don't R & D being conducted for copiers not like Canon, Xerox, KonicaMInolta & Xerox. If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck then it must be a duck. Toshiba's market share over the last ten years in the US has always been at or near the bottom of the pack, thus they are cellar dwellers, bottom feeders, in the US market. You are correct with the MA, they were not asking for...
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Re: Best Black & White MFP for 10k/month yeild. Suggestions?
Art, I like your general guidance to the initial poster, and I won't grade your writing since this isn't an English class. In regard to this brief post conversation, I think honesty is the best policy with customers and with ourselves. Yes Tim, they probably are in the top ten. However, the customer was asking which is the best. By rankings in the market place, the top seven do not include Toshiba. They fall within the bottom 7% of market share for shipments and the bottom 8.6% for market...
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Re: Best Black & White MFP for 10k/month yeild. Suggestions?
thanx for nor grading my English!!! most threads are done at night and I'll admit, I'm much better at selling than writing.
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Re: Does anyone have a clue as to how the CPC billing model started in the first place?
What came next with some dealers in the Oz market, was a guarantee that the client's copy costs would not rise annually, above a maximum of 10% which most clients would agree to. Or that it would only rise by the CPI, which these days is a joke of a deal, as it is only around 2%. But some now guarantee to hold the pricing for the term of the rental agreement, which at 5 years is just down right stupid.This has now become a lot more prevalent, as weak salesmen sell (if you can call it...
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Re: Does anyone have a clue as to how the CPC billing model started in the first place?
Wallingford Thanx for this! From your thread I can tell we all have most of the same issues. Anyone else care to help with their first experience with CPC?
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Re: Does anyone have a clue as to how the CPC billing model started in the first place?
I've only been around 9 years, but when I first started, we were selling the old Ricoh AP3800CMF (A3 color printer w/ a scanner kit attached to make it an MFP) since the 1224c/1232c was such a bust. In our Service Agreements, black toner was included in the CPP, but color toner was billable. When trying to get those customers to upgrade to the 2238c, I would create a cost per page analysis (since toner was included in our CPP for the 2238c) and had several furious customers who thought we...
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Re: Does anyone have a clue as to how the CPC billing model started in the first place?
I remember it well and at ComDoc, in the early 80's we sometimes put the offer out there without it being a formal price plan. I think the customer realized that a lot of the toner they purchased and stocked was useless at end of the machines life. It was like a primer with a customer who had that and TCO on their mind, it was a way to close them. Equally, I remember taking it one step further in the early 90's with copy management - the first all inclusive (hardware, service, supplies)...
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Re: Does anyone have a clue as to how the CPC billing model started in the first place?
I remember a plan that didn't really take hold but it was a plan like the one John talked about and all accessories were proposed in the form of copies...you want a finisher, just commit to 10,000 additional copies per month. The CPC rate had an equipment portion attached to it so more clicks funded more equipment. If the CPC was normal plus .003, 10,000 clicks added $30/month which would fund $1,500 additional. Some customers that weren't willing to pay $1,500 would agree to 10,000 more...
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Re: Does anyone have a clue as to how the CPC billing model started in the first place?
Wow! These are some awesome stories, I'm sure there are many more out there from some of our veterans, would love to read more.
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Re: Six Reasons Why Copiers Leases Can Cost You More Than You Signed For
Seriously? Which side are you on? Let's recognize that the dealer never pats for a lease return, it's just baked into the new lease. In this era of low margins, there is no room to offer these things for free. Additionally, there is no reputable dealer that would uplift 25% a year.
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Re: Six Reasons Why Copiers Leases Can Cost You More Than You Signed For
Cheryl Thanx for the response! I'm on the side of transparency. I want companies to recognize that there are some dealers that, well, they should not be doing business with. Here in the North East we're seeing some down right dirty tactics when it comes to moving product. You're right, no reputable dealer would uplift 25%, however we do have at leas one dealer that I know of that has the kind of uplift. Not sure what you meant here, can you clarify? "Let's recognize that the dealer never...
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Re: Six Reasons Why Copiers Leases Can Cost You More Than You Signed For
I didn't understand Cheryl's response either. Another important question is the length of the automatic renewal. At least the "renews for like term" seem to have gone away but I still see some 12 month renewals. In my opinion, a customer should never agree to Automatic Renewal Terms of more than 3 months with the 30 day renewal being the obvious best choice. For me, it's more about the integrity of the leasing company or the dealer pushing that particular lease company. Nobody plans on going...
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Re: Six Reasons Why Copiers Leases Can Cost You More Than You Signed For
take a loot at the attached file about Leasing
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Re: Six Reasons Why Copiers Leases Can Cost You More Than You Signed For
I received the below message via email yesterday. It's from Kevin Clune (President of Clune & Company LLC). I've known Kevin for years and appreciate his insight with leasing. Art, we haven’t talked in years but I still follow p4p. I liked your article about copier leasing but I thought I’d show you the attached marketing piece which shines a spotlight on some of the leasing industry’s most effective/injurious revenue enhancers. It’s a constantly evolving landscape as our industry is...
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Re: Four Bad Leasing Clauses I Ran Across This Week
Step Leases. A previous sales rep signed a 60 months term when a new sales rep comes in and upgrades the customer to a newer copier at a lower cost including a big free copy block at 36 months. The sales rep tells the customer your costs will never increase as long as you renew every 36 months and you will keep getting newer technology. Sounds too good to be true but many buyers fall for it as they see the now benefit and not the later obligation. Of course, the Balance of Payments is rolled...
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Re: Four Bad Leasing Clauses I Ran Across This Week
2 things regarding the evergreen clause: - If there is no evergreen clause, you would not get close to the residual you do get with it in the T's & C's. All of the residual is behavorial (evergreen) based....there's no actual equipment value in the residual.... I would explain to the lessee that their payment would've been much higher without the clause and that all in 60 month payments (without the clause) would be ~= to 66 months with a better residual (with the clause). - Do you not...
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Re: Four Bad Leasing Clauses I Ran Across This Week
WF, your comments are from a lease company's perspective. Nothing wrong with that but you wouldn't haver asked the questions you did if you were looking from a sales reps perspective. Sales reps don't get paid on residuals or evergreen sharing. And the 63 month term is just a poor sales reps way of offering a lower payment when he has nothing else to sell.
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Re: Four Bad Leasing Clauses I Ran Across This Week
One major leasing company now does a 12-month evergreen but its month to month for the original vendor and the original vendor can let the customer out of it if they complain.
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Re: Four Bad Leasing Clauses I Ran Across This Week
if your company has evergreen sharing - you as the sales rep are not compensated if the lessee goes into evergreens?
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Re: Four Bad Leasing Clauses I Ran Across This Week
That’s correct most reps do not get compensated with Evergreen clause. I know I don’t
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Re: Four Bad Leasing Clauses I Ran Across This Week
well I know some leasing companies that are starting to comp their reps on residual realization, not just volume... so maybe it can start getting passed on. (on IT collateral, not office imaging yet)
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Re: Four Bad Leasing Clauses I Ran Across This Week
We do revenue share and no, salesreps get no piece of that. I would be real surprised if any rep does, especially if the evergreen is mth-to-mth. First of all, it wouldn't amount to much and secondly, companies are not going to want to reward a rep financially for not getting a new deal done.
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Re: Escalating Maintenance Agreements
Art, We build in as much escalation as we can. Sometimes up to 15% on bundled lease/service...sometimes 5% on service only. On occcasion, none at all (primarily true produciton print accounts).
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Re: Escalating Maintenance Agreements
Ours escalate annually at 15% of the service payment. While I understand the need for this type of clause to hedge against cost increases from the manufacturers, gas prices and the like, think it has gotten out of hand. If a clause states that service may increase by up to 15% per year, that shouldn't mean "regardless of what the profitability is on your contract, we are going to increase it by 15% every year." My feeling is that every contract above a certain monthly payment (let's use...
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Re: Escalating Maintenance Agreements
24, While I agree with some of your comments, most of them are broad stroked ideas that in my opionion, would eventually lead to a failed business. And, good luck with having a conversation with all of your customers informing them that you need 45 pts(or whatever you think you need to survive) of profitability and that if thier account does not lend that percentage, you'll increase their expendature...whenever. Just an opinion.
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Re: Escalating Maintenance Agreements
I think having a business conversation with a customer or prospective customer is a better way of going about things than burying a clause in a contract, hoping they don't notice it & then fielding phone calls & emails from upset customers every year when their costs unexpectedly increase. The younger generation of decision-makers are looking for business partners, not vendors, & partnerships are a two way street. Some buyers may not appreciate this way of thinking, but I would...
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Re: Escalating Maintenance Agreements
Personally, I would rather be upfront with the customer (in many cases I am), rather than "hiding the cheese". I will admit that there are many occasions where I do not address the escalating cost of the service agreement, if it is brought up, I will then address it. I just see our industry as a whole "hiding the cheese" in many places. I will strive to tell more clients about the escalating increase, because I don't want to have a irate customer call me after the first year has expired.
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Re: Escalating Maintenance Agreements
tx, you are contrarian, and there's nothing wrong with that!!
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Re: Escalating Maintenance Agreements
Here's a different take and I'm going to use leasing to illustrate my point. 30 years ago the rate factor we used to calculate a monthly payment represented the leases's "true cost". Then our industry demanded lower rate factors without any concern for the terms of the contract. Over time, lower rate factors were offset by alternative forms of revenue for the leasing company...evergreen clauses, exaggerated property tax bills, forced insurance, etc. and the list continues to climb with the...
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Re: Escalating Maintenance Agreements
But now even, those "low" rate factors are now bumped to the sales person. Thus, the customer gets no advantage.
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Re: Escalating Maintenance Agreements
Originally Posted by Old Glory: Give me 20% lower cpc's 1st year with the intent of making it up over the next 5 years and we could rule the world. Unfortunately, what would have been a great idea before the advent of escalations, is now impossible because the powers that be have embraced the clause and have already made it an integral part of their profit structure. The same goes for the "points" or "ticks" dealers add on to the rates they receive from their leasing partners. At a certain...
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Re: Escalating Maintenance Agreements
We have the clause in the contract in bold on the first page. Always have. We have rarely raised any contracts though. Now we find customers with 8-10+ year old equipment where today they are still paying the same cpc as they were on day one. Our old software never had a means to efficiently track it. Our new software lets us very precisely monitor and manage these things. We have begun increasing the contracts on the oldest garbage we have in the field. Believe it or not we are now getting...
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Re: Escalating Maintenance Agreements
Our dealership increases the service portion of an agreement 12% per year or if we lock in the rate (up to 5 years on a new machine) then we take a 5% hit on the machine and a 3% hit on the maintenance agreement. I do not see a problem with a 4-6% increase per year ...that is easy to explain but 12% kills us on getting new business.
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Re: Escalating Maintenance Agreements
Jredmon: got it, are you having problems with existing accounts also when they are close to end of term?
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Re: Escalating Maintenance Agreements
For a long time we did not increase an agreement and we had a lot of old equipment that was difficult to upgrade due to the low cost but on the other hand as we implemented the 12% increases we had issues with the current customer feeling that we had taken advantage of them....Mainly due to the verbage on the contract that says "we may increase the agreement up to 12%", well we definately did the increase and at the 12% rate. Customer was hoping that they would not see an increase but if...
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Re: Escalating Maintenance Agreements
Originally Posted by jredmon: For a long time we did not increase an agreement and we had a lot of old equipment that was difficult to upgrade due to the low cost but on the other hand as we implemented the 12% increases we had issues with the current customer feeling that we had taken advantage of them....Mainly due to the verbage on the contract that says "we may increase the agreement up to 12%", well we definately did the increase and at the 12% rate. Customer was hoping that they would...
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Re: Escalating Maintenance Agreements
True...Very True....Much easier to sell and get the customer's buyin to a 4-6% increase.
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Re: Escalating Maintenance Agreements
True, but even then a client whose contract is performing within an acceptable range shouldn't be subject to an increase & I'm sure would appreciate being notified I advance that will not face an escalation in applicable years.
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Re: Escalating Maintenance Agreements
I'm told that he sales department makes zero profit, when in fact, if it were not for salespeople gaining net new, and keeping new accounts, there would be no service revenue.
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Re: Escalating Maintenance Agreements
Thru the use of our ERP software we review each and every contract annually for profitability. The % of increase, if any, is based upon the profitability of each contract. We do not do a blanket increase for the entire base. Increases can range from 0% to what ever it takes to get the contract on track. The whatever it takes amount is typically due to new customers having an extraordinarily high usage of toner. We track this and point it out to them as justification for the increase. Lets...
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Re: Escalating Maintenance Agreements
Perfectly said. I think we all agree (as would most of our clients) that a business has to make profit in order to stay in business, invest in growth & deliver a high level of service & support. What you just described, BG, is the transparency that I am certain most of our clients (at least the ones we want & have quality relationships with) would very much appreciate. Cheese is good & essential; it's the "hidden cheese" Art referenced that comes across as shady or...
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Re: Escalating Maintenance Agreements
So, the cheese in not the profit. I'm all about profit. It's those agreements and or contracts that state "may raise", "is subject to" , "could have", and never go on to state what the increases are on a year over year basis.
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Re: Escalating Maintenance Agreements
This is what we use to differentiate us from our competition. Honesty up front and no extra hidden billings. There are a number of dealers that don't track profitability or know how to properly price a contract from the beginning. They just raise contract prices because that's what they think the industry does. They have no clue if they are making money on a contract or not. They end up giving the rest of us a bad reputation. Its a painful education process for customers but well worth it...
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Re: Escalating Maintenance Agreements
WOW, this topic is blowing up! Don't want to get off track of the main topic here, however, under many cpc leases there is a clause that the entire monthly cost can increase by 10-15% each year. So, that's hardware and service, woweeee!!!
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Re: Escalating Maintenance Agreements
The competitors who have clauses in their contract that allow the total payment to be escalated by a certain amount are the easiest to sell against if you know they're in the deal early enough in the process to expose it as an issue.